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Booster plug vs power commander

Discussion in 'Exhaust System & Fuel Delivery' started by lj516, Jul 8, 2015.

  1. Hoser

    Hoser Active Member

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    It has been my understanding that any of the tools to fool the fuel system work until the Lambda sensors in the exhaust stream read the changes and readjusts the mix to come back to the preset values. This was an issue 10 years ago and the conclusion was that it was not effective after the bike readjusted the mixture to compensate. Do these add-ons now change the fuel mapping in the controls?
     
  2. UncleMart

    UncleMart New Member

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    Hi Hoser..

    As far as i am aware:
    On the 2013 - 14 R12GS LC the PCV instruction is to omit both Lambdas, hence I suppose that will clear the way to map it without too much interference from them ..
    I would imagine adding a DJ Autotune C/W some Wideband Lambdas would work alongside the PCV to keep it all in check though..?

    My 2011 GS PCV was wired in a similar fashion to the 13/14, it elimated the Lambdas.

    Not sure how it will work with / without the Lambdas when re-mapping the OE RS EFI/ECU, but i'll be finding out soon.

    Cheers,

    Unc.
     
  3. UncleMart

    UncleMart New Member

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    Hi Steeve...
    Warranty - not 100% sure, but have been told they are ok if you fit items in moderations, I.e A Can, or Can and headers, but not sure what they'd say if things were taken much further. They were aware of my mods (PCV etc) on previous BMs, and never commented....
    I reckon if push came to shove on an engine claim that we'd struggle....dependant on dealer.
    My own thoughts on this are by getting the right fuel (Richen up enough after mods) and the right ignition then i'd hope then never to get to problems that bring on warranty issues etc..
    My headers as St Steel.
    Cheers,
    Unc.
     
  4. Hoser

    Hoser Active Member

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    There is a detailed article about EFI and the different ways to modify the factory fuel settings in the September Motor Cyclist (page 70)
    The tuner they quoted has mostly been working on smoothing out the engine response and working on flat spots in the fueling from emissions regulations.
    Increasing horsepower has become a diminishing target as bikes have already gotten to their normal limits and not much is left on the table for normal operation.
     
  5. Bengaz

    Bengaz Member

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    MY tuner managed to get a whopping total of 4 HP on my S1000R over stock including fitting a full austen racing inconel system and a PCV.
    However on lower throttle increments he increased torque by up to 25% on a bike which already supposedly had brilliant fuelling.
    Needless to say the bike rode like nothing else when I got it back :)
     
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  6. Jan van der Meij

    Jan van der Meij Member

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    Strange. Mine did. However, it cost me more since I now had to buy the other options (which I wanted) separately (not a complete package anymore). Same for the LED strip (although this saved me some euros).
     
  7. Bengaz

    Bengaz Member

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    I don't care now anyway because |I have a lovely Akrapovic which |I might not have had :)
     
  8. MaxMobilis

    MaxMobilis Member

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    Does anyone know about this company and if yes had anyone tested?
    http://www.brentuning.com/tags/motorrad-ecu-tuning
    I have a believe that the most efficient tuning is professional remapping of the ECU.
    All other attempts, Booster Plug, PCV etc is just workarounds trying to manipulate the ECU.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2015
  9. Bazza Beemer

    Bazza Beemer Well-Known Member

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    I believe we just wait for someone to program over the stock ECU code and away we go. With modern fuelling, running and performance technology these things should run smooth over the entire engine range right from the factory. Otherwise it is up to BMW to remap the program to meet emissions and run nice. My son had a GTi new in 2007 and added an APR tune in at 2009. It was up from 200 to 285 at the front wheels and he added an intake system, exhaust plus other improvements (better fuel pump, cam button etc) and the fastest he got it to was 265kph and still going. It ran smooth throughout the operating range and never lost a drop of fuel economy. We have to simply wait for that tuner to come out simply add the tune, exhaust intake etc and it should map smooth on light throttle and go faster when you want to. Cheating/fooling the computer is not the way to go for longevity IMO.
     
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  10. apehair

    apehair New Member

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  11. Peter Burridge

    Peter Burridge Well-Known Member Contributor

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    It's usual practice with a PCV to remove the O2 sensors and fit eliminator plugs. I'm not sure that they are available for the RS.

    Autotune or it's equivalent uses wide band sensors in place of the originals.

    A Booster Plug won't affect the surging in closed loop mode. It acts to richen the mix in open loop mode only.
     
  12. Derek

    Derek New Member

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    Just fitted Akropovic headers and Slip on to my 2015 Gs, the Lamdas are still there and the flap servo, all cables removed servo in place, no F1 faults, performance is well improved but too loud and poppy for me, had a local exhaust specialist make a pair of baffles, used the end inserts from the Akro, non perforated pipe with a raised blank with a small hole in the centre, rode home and it sounds great, just right and very little loss of performance, the raspy edge to the exhaust has gone and no popping on the overrun, well pleased.
     
  13. JStClair

    JStClair Member

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    Full exhaust, no cat, K&N, and Booster plug. Runs excellent, and just got back from Ride Modes upgrade and yes, Dynamic do make a difference. I will most likely go PCV w/Autotune when more funds are avail, but for now it is averaging 46 mpg and runs like stink.
     
  14. shorn sheep

    shorn sheep Active Member

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    I totally agree, pcv and all the other piggy back fueling alterers can never achieve the performance and running efficiency that is possible through ecu tuning. My ecu is on its way to hilltop motors as we speak so I will be reporting back once the bike is back on the road. I was reading a thread on a ktm forum where hilltop was explaining how their software works, apparently it's installed into unused space inside the ecu yet is undetectable by the ecu or factory diagnostics. The software is self learning hence I am able to have my ecu implanted with the evil software then returned by mail to NZ and once reinstalled it will set itself up within a few minutes then sample every 7 seconds. Like most people I was a bit dubious as to whether these guys were any good but if you look on their facebook page they are tuning race bikes for the likes of Michael Dunlop and other top race teams so they must know a thing or two.
    It's interesting how factory mapping is often less fuel efficient even though it achieves low emissions, my car for example (6.2L V8 Holden) is something like 304kw stock but can be remapped and dyno tuned to achieve another 20-30 kw without any other mods, the tuners also guarantee significantly improved gas mileage and reviews confirm this. So how is using more gas to make less power and torque good for the environment? None of us should feel guilty for subverting the manufacturers settings to make our engines run efficiently, it shows how much bs is involved in the emissions regulating industry!
     
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  15. lj516

    lj516 Active Member

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    I'm on the opposite side of that opinion. The biggest problem I see with any system that uses the stock hardware is the oem O2 sensors. They are narrow band and can only sense rich, stoichiometric, or lean. No matter how good the program that will limit it's effectiveness and a power commander auto tune utilizes wide band sensors.
    Also, sending the ecu in means a generic map is used.
    The biggest factor to me is how much you want to tinker with the system. I love having the option to make and choose my own map for fuel economy or power with the flip of a switch. Not to mention seeing the results of my changes.
     
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  16. shorn sheep

    shorn sheep Active Member

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    Spoken like a true pc/autotune user!:) I'm not an expert on computer technology so I can't really argue much, both systems fill in some gaps in the fueling by different means but I believe pc only works by increasing fuel injector speed whereas infiltrating the ecu gives access to altering the ignition curves as well and the software can read all the engine sensors from the ecu which provides a lot more feedback than simply reading the mixture from an o2 plug. What I also like is the simplicity of not having the hardware, switches, wiring etc of a piggyback system. But I will wait till the bike is going and I can compare the performance before I say anything more!
     
  17. Aussie Import

    Aussie Import Well-Known Member

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    Just reading an article in the local paper today. It referred to EU countries putting down sunset periods for the manufacture of petrol powered vehicles. I suspect it will be manufacture or sale of new vehicles. One country seemed to be the non-EU, UK and the period there was quoted as starting at 2020.
    All of this petrol engine knowledge that we share will be obsolete in the foreseeable future if all of this is right.
     
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  18. lacemi

    lacemi Active Member

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    there is not for our model of motorcycle and nor for the year to have a modern ECU
     
  19. lacemi

    lacemi Active Member

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    when the cows give chocolate
     
  20. Richard230

    Richard230 Well-Known Member Contributor

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    Isn't that were chocolate milk sold in the grocery store come from? ;)
     
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